It's getting out of hand.

[Jenn]

In some public schools down here, some teachers need to send permission slips to the parents to be able to teach about evolution. One parent flipped over her child coming home talking about the big bang theory. She caused such a scene about it.

What is your take on this?

I believe that the teachers shouldn't have to ask for permission to teach about evolution. I hate the fact that the children can't even say "under God" anymore during the Pledge of Allegiance.

It's bad. I understand people have different beliefs, but just because you have a different belief system that doesnt give you a right to stop a teacher from teaching about something that has been taught for years in these schools.

And I dont care, my son knows the Pledge of Allegiance and he says Under God. And if the school has an issue with it, they can bite my ass.

[mcsmc]

The school system sucks in general.

[Stickman]

Can't really relate to the problem. Australia isn't anywhere near as religious or polictically correct as the US. I'm not saying that we aren't bad just not as bad. I went to a Catholic school and only got taught current scientific theories not religious theories.

[Violet]

Heh. It's unfortunate, but the idea of educating kids on other beliefs tends to scare the crap out of some Christians. I think it scares them that their kids might find out that not everyone has the same beliefs as them, and therefore they may start questioning their own.

We were taught about evolution. The THEORY of evolution. We were also well-informed that theory is just an idea, not fact. I'm pretty sure that not one single Christian kid in my class gave up their faith over it.

Personally, if I were a Christian, I'd want my kids to know about other beliefs, and when they came home at night and wanted to ask me why I still had faith when others didn't, I could give them educated answers. They're only setting themselves up for more generations of people with 'blind faith' and arguments that don't make any sense or hold any water.

Yeah, let's keep kids in the dark. That'll surely keep them in line. Pfft.

In reality, keeping these kids from learning about evolution and other beliefs and theories will probably just end up backfiring on them. I'd be pissed if my parents tried to prevent me from learning about something that was being taught in school. It would probably only serve to make me that much more curious and determined to find out as much as I could about it.

[Hardwood]

In reality, keeping these kids from learning about evolution and other beliefs and theories will probably just end up backfiring on them. I'd be pissed if my parents tried to prevent me from learning about something that was being taught in school. It would probably only serve to make me that much more curious and determined to find out as much as I could about it.

I know for a fact this is true as I have seen it in my own family. My cousins who were raised as strict Catholics (all 8) have all but one abandoned the religion and moved on to other things, some quite strange.

[Polar Bear]

I'm sure at one point, they taught kids in schools that the Earth was flat, and that 'heat' itself was actually an invisible liquid called caloric. Using your 'You have no right to stop a teacher from teaching something that has been taught for years' logic, they should still be teaching children that nonsence today.

The public school system is not the right venue to give thanks to ONE specific religion's deity. It worked 200 years ago. It doesn't work anymore. The hypocrisy present in Christian's arguments for it are fucking laughable in the extreme. It's a simple as "If it were Allah or Buddha instead of God, they would be up in fucking arms about how unfair it is'. Yet I still have to listen to idiots complaining about it, as if they had a leg to stand on.

News Flash Christians: You do not have a leg to stand on. Prayer and mention of God in schools is going away. Why?..Because it's the right thing to do, that's why. If and when I hear a convincing argument in favor of it, I'll change my opinion.

Ya know half of these people that complain about us doing away with religion in School don't even go to church every sunday. They cuss and swear, steal, lie, commit sexual acts outside of wedlock...etc... but they're going to complain about how religion is loosing it's grip in mainstream society?

Fuckin' please.

[Jenn]

Heh. It's unfortunate, but the idea of educating kids on other beliefs tends to scare the crap out of some Christians. I think it scares them that their kids might find out that not everyone has the same beliefs as them, and therefore they may start questioning their own.

We were taught about evolution. The THEORY of evolution. We were also well-informed that theory is just an idea, not fact. I'm pretty sure that not one single Christian kid in my class gave up their faith over it.

Personally, if I were a Christian, I'd want my kids to know about other beliefs, and when they came home at night and wanted to ask me why I still had faith when others didn't, I could give them educated answers. They're only setting themselves up for more generations of people with 'blind faith' and arguments that don't make any sense or hold any water.

Yeah, let's keep kids in the dark. That'll surely keep them in line. Pfft.

In reality, keeping these kids from learning about evolution and other beliefs and theories will probably just end up backfiring on them. I'd be pissed if my parents tried to prevent me from learning about something that was being taught in school. It would probably only serve to make me that much more curious and determined to find out as much as I could about it.

The one thing that baffles me is that this never was an issue until some athiest started shit about the whole, "Under God" issue. Never once did I hear about any families having an issue about it, never. Nowadays everything is wrong, and it pisses me off.

[Hardwood]

The one thing that baffles me is that this never was an issue until some athiest started shit about the whole, "Under God" issue. Never once did I hear about any families having an issue about it, never. Nowadays everything is wrong, and it pisses me off.

I completely understand your frustration. That is the reason I called myself an agnostic. I have no problem with people believing in god and I too believe it is possible (like a pink elephant falling through the roof....still possible)
I have no problem with schools teaching the things they have for years (didn't fuck me up too bad) but I believe they need to upgrade too.
Mind you this is coming from an old man with no children.
I guess I am a passive athiest.............

[Absinthe]

German schools don't make this an issue. Kids learn about both concepts. I have no experience with american schools, but the Evolution subject fits right into the same category as the "happy-holidays-instead-of-merry-christmas" mess.
Would it be so difficult to teach kids both points? They can make up their minds later on, but they should have the opportunity to see both sides.

Also, there is a difference between a "scientific theory" and the commonly used "theory". A scientific theory is a testable model which is based on facts (fossils are a fact, right?). The interpretation of these facts might differ from person to person, but they are still facts. Newton's theory of Universal Gravitation is a fact, for example.

[Jenn]

I completely understand your frustration. That is the reason I called myself an agnostic. I have no problem with people believing in god and I too believe it is possible (like a pink elephant falling through the roof....still possible)
I have no problem with schools teaching the things they have for years (didn't fuck me up too bad) but I believe they need to upgrade too.
Mind you this is coming from an old man with no children.
I guess I am a passive athiest.............

I don't see anything wrong with other religions, except for the ones that say kill and you get 13 virgins, or whatever the fuck it is now...

But it's simple.. you dont believe in something and don't want your child to participate, than tell that child NOT to say it(Under God). Its not like the child is going to suffer because of it.

My sons class had a christmas party, and all the kids had a buddy to get and recieve gifts from. Well, my husband and I were invited to the party and all of the children sat in a circle and gave their gifts. There was one little girl who didn't get anything or recieve anything. She sat there, watched while all of the children got their gifts looking so sad. I felt so sorry for her. Her parents (two females, i dont remember which religion) stated that she was not allowed.

Why couldn't they leave her out of school? It was just a half of day, and just a party. I understand you have beliefs, but that was wrong. She was four, she doesnt understand.

[Hardwood]

parents (two females, i dont remember which religion) stated that she was not allowed.

Why couldn't they leave her out of school? It was just a half of day, and just a party. I understand you have beliefs, but that was wrong. She was four, she doesnt understand.

Neither do I......
I bet you can't find anyone who does.
Religion is a weekness and it scares me.

[Absinthe]

Why couldn't they leave her out of school? It was just a half of day, and just a party. I understand you have beliefs, but that was wrong. She was four, she doesnt understand.

I totally agree with you. If the parents don't want the child to participate than they should keep her at home, but don't have her sitting there watching the other kids having fun. That's just wrong. Poor thing, that makes me sad...

[Shade]

The schools need to teach knowledge, not religion. The pledge of allegence says 'under god' so thats fact, If you want to change that being tought, try to get it changed for the nation. Evolution is a theory, a widely accepted theory. So it should be taught. Genetics is a fact. It should be taught. Religion is a belief structure, it's not a theory. It should not be taught. What should be taught is the effects of religion upon history/culture/writing/mathmatics. If you disagree with this, instead of trying to keep your kid ignorant, you should teach them the other side as well. If i don't plan on raising my kid to believe in evolution, i wouldn't shun him from the subject, i would show him/her my reasons for not believing in it. If my reasons are not strong enough, then maybie i might need to check myself. No one likes to be kept ignorant, especially children. It's there biggest resentment against parents. Like someone said earlier, once they find out, they say 'fuck it' to whatever kept them ignorant in the first place.

[Jenn]

I totally agree with you. If the parents don't want the child to participate than they should keep her at home, but don't have her sitting there watching the other kids having fun. That's just wrong. Poor thing, that makes me sad...

It made me sad too. After the gifts were given, the teachers gave out stockings with little hard books inside, and she couldn't even take that.

[Jenn]

The schools need to teach knowledge, not religion. The pledge of allegence says 'under god' so thats fact, If you want to change that being tought, try to get it changed for the nation. Evolution is a theory, a widely accepted theory. So it should be taught. Genetics is a fact. It should be taught. Religion is a belief structure, it's not a theory. It should not be taught. What should be taught is the effects of religion upon history/culture/writing/mathmatics. If you disagree with this, instead of trying to keep your kid ignorant, you should teach them the other side as well. If i don't plan on raising my kid to believe in evolution, i wouldn't shun him from the subject, i would show him/her my reasons for not believing in it. If my reasons are not strong enough, then maybie i might need to check myself. No one likes to be kept ignorant, especially children. It's there biggest resentment against parents. Like someone said earlier, once they find out, they say 'fuck it' to whatever kept them ignorant in the first place.

I agree.


As long as my son isnt being forced to believe something, i really dont care if he gets taught something that I wouldnt believe in. I don't even care if he learns about other religions. Im learning about them now in one of my classes, and I think its extremely interesting.

[Violet]

Would it be so difficult to teach kids both points?

I hear ya. I'm not even a Christian, but I'd prefer to see my child learn what he can from all sides and make his own decisions. I'll never press him to take up my beliefs, or lack thereof, and I'll thank him not to push his on me when he makes his own decisions.

They can make up their minds later on

I think that's what some people are afraid of.

[Stickman]

I agree.


As long as my son isnt being forced to believe something, i really dont care if he gets taught something that I wouldnt believe in. I don't even care if he learns about other religions. Im learning about them now in one of my classes, and I think its extremely interesting.

One of my compulsory senior subjects was study of religion. Certainly I think it's an excellent subject. We were taught all the worlds major religions and their beliefs. Also issues in religions and a bunch of other things. I think it was a good to learn it all. While at the time I thought it was a boring heap of shit. It's one of those things you look back on and appreciate that a Catholic school bothered to teach you about all religions and didn't try and force feed me anything. Well there was the occasional prayer but they didn't force you to recite them or anything.

[Fishypancake]

In some public schools down here, some teachers need to send permission slips to the parents to be able to teach about evolution. One parent flipped over her child coming home talking about the big bang theory. She caused such a scene about it.

What is your take on this?

I believe that the teachers shouldn't have to ask for permission to teach about evolution. I hate the fact that the children can't even say "under God" anymore during the Pledge of Allegiance.

It's bad. I understand people have different beliefs, but just because you have a different belief system that doesnt give you a right to stop a teacher from teaching about something that has been taught for years in these schools.

And I dont care, my son knows the Pledge of Allegiance and he says Under God. And if the school has an issue with it, they can bite my ass.

People are running out of things to get mad about. There is no point, in my opinion, to have to make every single tiny little thing acceptable to every single little person. People have been teaching evolution, and all that jazz for years, and kids have been coming home to religous familys asking why when the parents do not even know. The parents back in the day could learn to deal with it, but I am not sure if you noticed, but generation after generation ever since the turning point of 1969 people have been getting lazier, stupid, and generally less usefully than possible, so as time gose on the parents of kids get lazy, and stupid. They can not deal with the hard questions that even they do not know, get mad, and cause a scene. Fuck religion, im high, get off me.

[Shade]

all that jazz

Classy!