Legalize the Sticky Icky.

[CrAnIuM]

Yeah .. here is the debate and article.

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SAN FRANCISCO – A bill to tax and regulate marijuana in California like alcohol would generate nearly $1.4 billion in revenue for the cash-strapped state, according to an official analysis released Wednesday by tax officials.
The State Board of Equalization report estimates marijuana retail sales would bring $990 million from a $50-per-ounce fee and $392 million in sales taxes.


The bill introduced by San Francisco Democratic Assemblyman Tom Ammiano in February would allow adults 21 and older to legally possess, grow and sell marijuana.


Ammiano has promoted the bill as a way to help bridge the state's $26.3 billion budget shortfall.


"It defies reason to propose closing parks and eliminating vital services for the poor while this potential revenue is available," Ammiano said in a statement.


The way the bill is written, the state could not begin collecting taxes until the federal government legalizes marijuana. A spokesman says Ammiano plans to amend the bill to remove that provision.


The legislation requires all revenue generated by the $50-per-ounce fee to be used for drug education and rehabilitation programs. The state's 9 percent sales tax would be applied to retail sales, while the fee would likely be charged at the wholesale level and built into the retail price.
The Equalization Board used law enforcement and academic studies to calculate that about 16 million ounces — or 500 tons — of marijuana are consumed in California each year.


Marijuana use would likely increase by about 30 percent once the law took effect because legalization would lead to falling prices, the board said.
Estimates of marijuana use, cultivation and sales are notoriously difficult to come by because of the drug's status as a black-market substance. Calculations by marijuana advocates and law enforcement officials often differ widely.


"That's one reason why we look at multiple reports from multiple sources — so that no one agenda is considered to be the deciding or determining data," said board spokeswoman Anita Gore.


Advocates and opponents do agree that California is by far the country's top pot-producing state. Last year law enforcement agencies in California seized nearly 5.3 million plants.


If passed, Ammiano's bill could increase the tension between the state and the U.S. government over marijuana, which is banned outright under federal law. The two sides have clashed often since state voters passed a ballot measure in 1996 legalizing marijuana for medical use.
At the same time, some medical marijuana dispensary operators in the state have said they are less fearful of federal raids since U.S. Attorney General Eric Holder said the Justice Department would defer to state marijuana regulations.


Advocates pounced on the analysis as ammunition for their claim that the ban on marijuana is obsolete.


"We can't borrow or slash our way out of this deficit," said Stephen Gutwillig, California state director of the Drug Policy Alliance. "The legislature must consider innovative sources of new revenue, and marijuana should be at the top of that list."


Ammiano's bill is still in committee. Hearings on the legislation are expected this fall.


Also Wednesday, three Los Angeles City Council members proposed taxing medical marijuana to help close the city's budget gap.
Council members Janice Hahn, Dennis Zine and Bill Rosendahl backed a motion asking city finance officials to explore taxing the drug.
Hahn said that with more than 400 dispensaries operating in the city, the tax could generate significant revenue. The motion pointed out that a proposed tax increase on medical marijuana in Oakland, which has only four dispensaries, was projected to bring in more than $300,000 in 2010.
Meanwhile, marijuana supporters have taken the first official step toward putting the legalization question directly to California voters.
A trio of Northern California criminal defense attorneys on Wednesday submitted a pot legalization measure to the state attorney general's office, which must provide an official summary before supporters can begin gathering signatures.



About 443,000 signatures are necessary to place The Tax, Regulate and Control Cannabis Act on the November 2010 ballot. The measure would repeal all state and local laws that criminalize marijuana.










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Two things:


1. I am IN FAVOR of legal drug use.

Some of you will no doubt call me a hypocrite, especially those of you that I call pot heads.

But my issue with pot is not that you use it. MY ISSUE is that you use it illegally and in an irresponsible manner, i.e before and during work.

I have LONG been in favor of the legal sale and use of commercially grown and commercially rendered marijuana.

I want it packaged, sold, and and MOST of all TAXED.



2. Historical FBI data states that any prohibition on a consumable substance creates an immediate and in most cases a militant criminal element.

If walmart and others sell an item the street value is erased, and the local "businessman" usually disappears. In this case taking MOST of the crime with it.

I am not looking at this with Rose colored glasses ... I know that MORE people will use it if its legal, I know that not all home growth and crime will be eliminated BUT more good will come from legal use than from keeping it illegal.

Also .. cigarette smokers have become a fucking outcast in society, its taxed heavily and banned from use in damn near every public locale.

The decades of copious use of cigarettes has led to its social outcast status of today.


I feel the legal use and selling of marijuana WILL lead to eventual LESS use over time.







Well .. thats my 2 cents.

[SlimSkeeter]

I had a surprising discussion with one of my best friends fathers a short time ago about this. He is a staunch republican with iron clad christian values etc. but he was very much in favor of legalizing pot (as am I). Upon discussing it we realized that it may be just about the only way left to get us, as a nation, out of debt. Rather, that it would at least slow the rate of debt increase.


IMO pot is less of an issue than alcohol. You, in spite of those "what is your anti-drug" commercials, have never heard about someone toking up some sweet bud and committing vehicular manslaughter or getting high and beating the fuck out of his wife and kids. The most that happens is snack food sales spike a bit.

I'll have to do a bit of research on it but I remember reading that the only reason marijuana is illegal to begin with is that cotton farmers feared that hemp would replace their crop as the go-to source for fabric. Yes, I know the hemp they use in fabric is "industrial grade" and contains negligible levels of THC, however it does come from the same genus of plants. I believe broccoli also comes from the same genus, though. wooo, scary, eh?

So, yes, legalize it. Tax the fuck out of it, reap the benefits, quit being nancy boys about it and start exploring all aspects of its use.

[KommieKat]

"I feel the legal use and selling of marijuana WILL lead to eventual LESS use over time."

I disagree with this. It will most certainly increase use, in a responsible manner.

It's been years for me, but if I could get my hands on a joint right now, I'd Bogart the hell out of it. It'd be so soggy, you couldn't light it up.

[Incognito]

The reason why its illegal is because back when it was first banned, the government lied to the public. They ran ads telling people that pot was highly addictive and made users lose their minds (Reefer Madness). Those lies scared the hell out of people and that fear still resonates. Its mostly old people who are against the legalization of cannabis.

Also, the government claimed (and still claims) that weed kills brain cells. Long long ago, they conducted scientific tests on monkeys where they put gas masks on them and pumped marijuana into the monkeys' lungs for 5 minutes at a time over a period of time (not sure). The tests revealed that the monkeys lost brains cells due to the tests. What they DIDN'T tell people (and maybe they themselves where too dense to realize) is that the use of a gas mask was the wrong way to conduct these tests because the monkeys were deprived of oxygen for 5 minutes at a time. It doesn't take a genius to know that if you deprive a brain of oxygen, cells will die.

[Cúchulainn]

I hate it when Quasimodo's got a valid point.

[TopGrey]

Eh, legal or not, why the fuck do drugs? Seriously? Unless it is necessary for relief of pain, why in the world would you smoke/shoot up/snort the shit? Yes, the same could be said of alcohol, and it would be true. So why drink? BECAUSE every once in a damned while I like to get a lil loose! So drink up, smoke up, and be happy!! Just make sure you're happy ass is going to be responsible enough to ensure the safety of those around you.

BTW--good friend of mine smoked LOTS o' pot. Swore up and down he's a better driver when high. Well, 20 years ago I remember riding with him while high.....the only reason you could assert he was better was because he was dring 20 mph in a 50 zone with both hands fastened to the wheel like vice grips LOL.

Also, any of you ever heard of being allergic to weed? No shit, when I smoked it in my youth a couple things would happen:

1. within 10 min I'd puke up my guts.....then it was fine.

2. I got super twitchy. Everyone else would be sitting back smiling like Cheshire cats except me...I'd be bouncing of the fucking walls saying "LET'S GO DO SOMETHING AAAAHHHGGHHHAAAHHHHH" which would have the effect of killing their collective buzzes.

3. After 20 minutes, give or take, my ass muscles would start buzzing, almost like the sensation you get from riding a lawn tractor for hours, and would only lead to further feelings of needing to get the fuck up to do something.

Oh well, have smoked it in 15 years so I don't know what it'd do to me at 36. Maybe it's time to give it a go.

[Violet]

My dad's been on pain killers since he broke his back in his mid-20's, and the prescriptions and dosages have only climbed with the four back surgeries he's had since. It pisses me off to no end that he's been prescribed addictive and potentially dangerous medications (such as Oxycontin) and he could get in trouble for toking some grass.

There are commercials on television every day with warnings of a possible side effect of DEATH, and a drug that is less dangerous than alcohol still can't be prescribed in most states.

I'm pleased to see the debate is up for recreational use. I've known fools who would get high before work, but I've also known idiots who would put back a few beers on their lunch hour only to get back on their forklift minutes later. I think when used responsibly it can be a good time with fewer dangers than alcohol. (Besides, hangovers are a bitch.)

Also, by legalizing it in the states, less money would also be put in the hands of the Mexican drug cartels. So, yeah, win-win.

[Saucy]

I had a surprising discussion with one of my best friends fathers a short time ago about this. He is a staunch republican with iron clad christian values etc. but he was very much in favor of legalizing pot (as am I). Upon discussing it we realized that it may be just about the only way left to get us, as a nation, out of debt. Rather, that it would at least slow the rate of debt increase.


IMO pot is less of an issue than alcohol. You, in spite of those "what is your anti-drug" commercials, have never heard about someone toking up some sweet bud and committing vehicular manslaughter or getting high and beating the fuck out of his wife and kids. The most that happens is snack food sales spike a bit.

http://newsone.blackplanet.com/enter...atal-accident/

He was drunk and high! Damn! But we'll blame it on the al al al alcohol!

Seems to be the case with every manslaughter.

I'm not "hating" on pot, yes it makes sense to tax it and yes those anti-weed commercial go alittle to far. But, seriously to say weed is harmless. Come on now! They're people out there who eat people. What if that dude got the munchies?!?!?!?

Honestly, weed and alcohol are pretty much the same. I had friends who smoked Kb and would start crying about their exes. I get drunk with my friends and all we ever want to do is hit up a fast food joint. It's the same shit. You get the "Munchies" from both! You get "Emo" from both! You "wonder" about things! I just don't see anyone fighting on weed....oh wait nevermind..I have. Damn. I fucked up the statistic.

But, if it does become legal, now I gotta worried about the drunk driver and the yuppies hot boxing their car listening to woogie boogie music. Damn.

Bottomline is this...Not everyone is responsible, has common sense...yadda. So if it gets into the wrong hands and that person fucks up your day or you catch your kid high as fuck. Will you be okay with that?

win/lose situation. =(

[Gzus]

Im definately all for it.
I smoke weed on a daily basis, so to speak.
Topgrey - The first few times I smoked weed (about 12 / 13 years old)It started off after I caught a great liking in Bob Marley tunes.
It fucked me up completely, in a similar way as you have described. After a couple of times though, I guess I got used to it.
Much the same as with alcohol, which Ive started at around 16-ish.
One bottle of beer (500ml) and I was fucking toast. Behaving like a total ass, obnoxious, irresponsible, and genrellay, just fucking out of it.
Now I guzzle beer, and behave pretty well, compared to the first few months of consuming alcohol.
I also agree with the fact that Marijuana, is a better substance to use, and especially, abuse.

[Dirty Hippie]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/0...n_1305079.html

[Afroman] I was going to post this earlier... but then I got high [/Afroman]

Colorado will most likely become the first state to completely legalize marijuana later this year. The proposition will be on the ballots this November and state polls show more than a 50% approval rate. I think this is great news and it will be interesting to see how the feds react given the scuffles with medical marijuana dispensaries lately.

[CrAnIuM]

Colorado will most likely become the first state

Unfortunately the Federal government has shown that it will not leave this alone and will not let this be a choice made by a state and will still use Fed arrest privileges in need be.

[Dirty Hippie]

I also wanted to vent about one of the arguments that the anti-marijuana people make

Statistics show that marijuana was responsible for 7% of all automobile accidents

No, the study showed that 7% of people in accidents that were tested showed up as positive for marijuana. The problem is that the active component (THC) is metabolized into inactive cannabinoids which are stored in our fat cells and therefore stay in our system for days, weeks or months depending on how often you smoke. All that testing shows is that the person consumed marijuana at least once over the last x amount of time. It would be like saying alcohol was responsible for a crash because they found a few empty cans of beer in the person's garbage can from 2 weekends ago.

[Dirty Hippie]

I think even if the feds decide to bust all the big dispensaries it could be a very valuable measuring stick for the rest of the country to use (as the medical marijuana case has been a measuring stick that CO has used itself to even bring about this ballot initiative). Smaller scale dispensaries, home gardens, etc. will now become more commonplace and they can serve as the poster child for what could be an overturning of federal law. If statistics start showing up that legalization has not led to increased crime, increased accidents, increased health issues, etc. then that could change some people's minds about the harmfulness of marijuana.

[Dirty Hippie]

Already there has been quite a dramatic turnaround for the public view on the issue.



I believe the latest polls show the legal/illegal split being almost 50/50. Hell, even Christian conservative nutjobs are starting to come around.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/nation...HzR_story.html

[CrAnIuM]

The bible thumpers are having a frenzy over condoms and birth control pills. I don't see a "normal" politician taking up the banner of legal cannabis any time soon.

[Capt.]

The bible thumpers are having a frenzy over condoms and birth control pills. I don't see a "normal" politician taking up the banner of legal cannabis any time soon.

Let me answer this first. I believe in God. I DO NOT SUPPORT ORGANIZED RELIGION. While I am solid in my beliefs, I think that organized religion is the cause of most of societies morality issues. In the bible it says to go out and spread the good word of Jesus Christ. NOWHERE in those pages does it say to condemn and punish your fellow man for their personal beliefs or moral values. As a Christian, you are tasked with something that you would do whether you are a religious or not. You are tasked with trying to help the people you love and care about improve themselves, and be happy. You can be the most staunch atheist on the planet, but I guarantee if you saw your closest cousin or nephew using crack, you'd do something to help them. Sadly, these religious zealots take everything way to far, and now the Middle East is riddled with factions of whack-jobs killing each other in the name of their Gods. What a great example they set.

Now, on to pot.

Ahh, the good old green. I smoked it for years, and loved it. Yeah, there was always a better place to spend my money, but whatever, everybody makes mistakes. I could go into the argument about tobacco being worse for your lungs, etc, etc...but the fact of the matter is anything "smoke" is not good for your lungs. Selling/Taxing the product is a good idea, but nothing will keep it out of the hands of minors. You used to get beer pretty easy from an older friend/brother/parents. So don't expect regulations to work. Like most other things in this country, corporate politics have ruined hemp.

In short, I see nothing wrong with legalizing it. Stop the shenanigans, sell it in 7-11's, and just do our best. The income would definitely help the economy.

[Polar Bear]

NOWHERE in those pages does it say to condemn and punish your fellow man for their personal beliefs or moral values.

Actually it does. Numerous times. Here's just a few...

Deutoronomy 22:20-1 "But if the thing is true, that evidence of virginity was not found in the young woman, then they shall bring out the young woman to the door of her father’s house, and the men of her city shall stone her to death with stones, because she has done an outrageous thing in Israel by whoring in her father’s house. So you shall purge the evil from your midst."

Lev. 20:13 "If a man lies with a male as with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination; they shall surely be put to death; their blood is upon them."

Lev 20:19 "For anyone who curses his father or his mother shall surely be put to death; he has cursed his father or his mother; his blood is upon him."

Sorry if I'm hijacking, but people need to know what's in the Bible themselves before they go telling other people what's in there.

[Dirty Hippie]

Old Testament is no joke! Another on topic noteworthy verse

Genesis 1:29 "And God said, Behold, I have given you every plant bearing seed, which is upon the face of all the earth, and every tree, which has seed in its fruit; to you it shall be for food"

So god clearly created marijuana for us, although his preferred method of ingesting was by space cakes. Interestingly enough, he doesn't seem to be a fan of sinsemilla since he mentioned bearing seed.

[Capt.]

Sorry if I'm hijacking, but people need to know what's in the Bible themselves before they go telling other people what's in there

I apologize for my near-sightedness. Thank you for bringing that to my attention.